Beating Podcast Procrastination: Ida Radovanovic's Productivity Tips
Hi there! I'm chatting with Ida Radovanovic from Playground in this week's episode.
Ida called her business a Playground to keep reminding herself how she wanted to see work.
After 12+ years of career at a corporation, Ida is now proudly a solopreneur. She blends gamification, accountability buddies and research-based productivity tips to help people work on what is meaningful to them and spark closeness. It's an unusual, but powerful mix vs. procrastination.
If you are tired of procrastination games ;) and want a more creative way to get stuff done, feel free to connect with Ida and say hi.
Ida shares her top 4 tips for overcoming procrastination:
1. If you don't know where to start, start with something small and specific. Something that you can clearly mark off as complete.
2. Use a planning system. Ida recommends WOOP and Backwards goal planning.
3. Try to work with less perfectionism and be kind to yourself. "80% done is good enough!"
4. Remind yourself that you are part of a community or get yourself an accountability buddy.
Ida has Tip number 5 for you to download here.
Procrastinating with your podcast 😬?
The next 3-month Anti-Procrastination Playground Programme starts: Oct 31st at 18.00 GMT. Learn more HERE.
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Transcript
Rachael Botfield: [00:00:00] Hi, and welcome to podcasting 101 with Rachael. This podcast is for busy female entrepreneurs who run their own businesses and want to start a podcast or who may already have a podcast. I want to share practical information and tips on how you can get your podcast started and managing it along the way.
I'll also be interviewing other female podcast hosts to give you real insight into what it's like. Have
Hi,
and welcome to this week's episode today I have with me Ida and she is from the, the founder of Playground. Ida blends gamification, accountability buddies, and research-based productivity tips to help [00:01:00] people work on what is meaningful to them and spark closeness. And it's an unusual, but power, powerful mix versus procrastination.
Welcome, Ida. It's really, really great to have you here on the podcast. How are you?
Ida Radovanovic: Hi, Rachael. Yeah, that was a lot of big words for my playground.
Yes, I am the founder of this unusual platform for anti procrastination. And I called it a playground because I want to remind myself and maybe you as well, what is really important and how we can do our business in a different way.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah. I like that. I like the, I like it saying playground.
Ida Radovanovic: Yes.
You know, like, how can we play more with what? What we are creating, because of course we care a lot about what we make. And sometimes in the creating process, we can get a little bit rigid and perfectionistic, but if we go back to it this is something I think that most of us [00:02:00] choose and that we care about.
So how can we have that a little bit of a different mindset towards it, that not take it so seriously and enjoy the process?
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, sometimes it can be, it can feel like a painful process if we're especially trying to do something that we might not necessarily want to get started for whatever reason.
So how did you come to get into being a solo business owner? You know, I see that you were in you have a corporate background. What made you make the shift into, you know, a solo business owner?
Ida Radovanovic: Well I was in a corporate world for like 12 years, but it was always in my mind thinking of what, what I really want to be doing, like what is really meaningful.
To me and you know, especially during Corona, I think when we were stuck and when we were thinking about that a lot, what we really care about this is when this became more obvious or I can be totally honest. It's not that at this [00:03:00] time I had this idea and I was like, okay, let's do it. No. I have quit my job just before Corona and wanted to be a social entrepreneur.
So I wanted to create a business that also supports, you know, the planet and the people and is profitable in tourism, but since we got locked, that was not possible. I was back
at the drawing board. But I definitely knew that my next step was something. That I was really going to create from my heart. And I was in the situation of being in a new situation, being alone. And so, how can you surpass that and start creating and take those risks? And then, okay, start, but also continue.
So, that mix of, like, creating something. Meaningful than leaning on someone else and also kind of not taking yourself too seriously while you're doing it. Those [00:04:00] are all the elements of how I wish the world would be more like and this is why I'm also making my playground so we can. together do all of that.
Rachael Botfield: So who are the main kinds of people that you're helping with the work that you're doing?
Ida Radovanovic: Well, I help people usually solopreneurs or maybe somebody who wants to work on their side hustle. Or maybe somebody on a passion project. So it doesn't necessarily have to be related to, you know, like a monetary thing, but maybe you would just really like to start creating a podcast and you're postponing it.
And now you arrive and you get connected with somebody who is in a similar situation. So this is your accountability buddy. And then you're in this together and you enter a system that I created. So for three months you are progressing week by week, committing to what you will do. So it's [00:05:00] very specific, very simple.
And you're also playing games. So and maybe now you wonder what, how do games come in, come into this whole equation. It's not like the Super Mario and points and all of this because some of my friends thought this is what happens. No. These are more like conversations and get to know your games so that you actually talk about what you are creating or maybe what you are not creating.
Via a game, so that you relax, you're you know, a little bit more of an authentic self, you get new ideas being in a let's say framework where you're playing versus like delivering and tasks really helps. To keep us to start and to keep us going and to connect us to the other person who is in a similar situation.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, I think that's important, isn't it? Having, I do like having an accountability person there. I think it does, it does work. I, I feel that's something that helps me as well. I attend some [00:06:00] accountability sessions where we just kind of sit on zoom, but we all have a thing that we need to get done. And, and, you know, we, we do that thing in that hour.
So I, I. I really like that method of working. So obviously since I met you and heard about you and got to know you a little bit more about being anti procrastination, I thought it would make a really great episode. That's why we're here. For all of you that haven't started your podcast yet, and maybe procrastinating on certain tasks to get it finished or to even start it.
So I wanted either to come along and. a little bit about what she does. And also she's going to be giving us some tips and advice around what you can do to, for some, so how you can move forward with your, your podcast project, whatever that may be, however, whatever state is in currently. So what would be your first kind of tip Ida?
Ida Radovanovic: I have so many, but I tried to downsize so that you get something specific that [00:07:00] you can, you know, take away from, from this episode. Although I just spoke to Rachel and I said that I will talk about the four, but then we will put a secret little link for an extra tip inside the notes.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah. So we can, you can look out for that in the show notes on the website and on your podcast apps.
Ida Radovanovic: Because, you know, of course you will listen through all the tips, maybe you will know some of them, but more importantly it is that you action something out. So if nothing from the listening, you can action the one, the secret little link in the middle of the notes.
Rachael Botfield: And that's what you want to do to beat that procrastination is follow through and do that actionable thing.
Ida Radovanovic: Yes. We get out of our heads, you know? Okay. Okay. Okay. So, so I do want to give you something pragmatic and something that you can use. So I was thinking about these four tips. So the first one being if you are starting something or, you know, if you're in this situation, Oh, I just can't [00:08:00] seem to start.
And maybe it is that you would. You want to start your podcast, maybe you're back from holidays and you need to restart your projects. Or maybe you are a business owner and then you have a podcast, but you now need to start promoting it. So we are all starting something, right? And so the, the first tip would be to start with something really small and also very specific.
So, again, I'm going to give an example because I think those work really well. So instead of being like, oh, I should really come up with some kind of content strategy. Something really small would be, I'm going to spend five minutes brainstorming ideas for content. So the small thing should really be something that you can't say no to.
I mean, everybody has five minutes, right? Yep.
Rachael Botfield: Yep, absolutely.
Ida Radovanovic: And then also make it [00:09:00] very specific so that you can, you know, be honest with yourself. Did I do this or I didn't do this?
Rachael Botfield: So you've got your item, you can tick off and say, right, I have done that. In that five minutes,
Ida Radovanovic: exactly, because, you know, the counter example would be like, Oh, I'm going to do a research.
Okay. But what, where, when, how long, you know, so just be pick something small that you won't procrastinate and make it specific. So that's the first step. Then the second one that I also see people have often is that we have so many things that on our to do lists, or maybe we have a lot of ideas that we are excited about.
This is also a great situation to have but then again, we don't begin. So what we can do there is to use a planning system. Maybe you already have. Something that you like. What I use on my playground, and what I personally also use when I'm working, and I work alone[00:10:00] are two different things.
So one is called a woop. I don't know if you've heard of it, Rachel, before. No, no, I've
Rachael Botfield: not heard of that one.
Ida Radovanovic: Yes. So apart from having, I like to say a very cool name, like whoop whoop, you know, immediately like tears you on, it is a, like scientifically scientifically proven method, which helps us move from like this wishful thinking into actually having a plan.
And it stands for WOOP. So first you think of your wish. And the best possible outcome, you know, when they tell us all, like, think about, you know, like visualize and there's all the positive stuff, that's good, but it's not enough, science tells us. So then the next step from that is also to do, to brainstorm all the obstacles.
So, okay, this is really great, but you know that you do this to yourself, like the inner critic, you know, is telling you, yeah, Rachel, but okay, now I don't have time or [00:11:00] like, I don't know, whatever it could be. Yeah, absolutely. So you come. Right? So you then contrast these two and make a plan. And if you want, for our listeners, maybe we can try to do a mini test where Rachel does her first WOOP now.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah. I'm up for that.
Ida Radovanovic: Yes. So the first step, and you guys can maybe think about your own is what kind of, so what is your wish for this podcast?
Rachael Botfield: Can it be, does it need to be something really specific? Like, Yeah. Or is it just like a general wish? No,
Ida Radovanovic: this is like the grandiose, this is the video. Like, oh, a wish, that my podcast was.
Rachael Botfield: Okay, so what was my wish for this podcast? I, oh,
I would, I suppose, I just want to help, help everyone get their podcast started. So I guess my wish. For this podcast is to build a community around the podcast. So the there's, it's helping [00:12:00] have that tangible thing of being able to knowing that I'm out there and giving this information to help people move forward with their podcast.
So I'd like to kind of build a community around it. Okay.
Ida Radovanovic: I love it. And now be honest with us. So what is your, like, obstacle? What is your internal obstacle that, you know, on those days when you're not doing it, what is telling you?
Rachael Botfield: My internal obstacle is that no one's going to turn up. Like, if I started, you know, a Facebook group, because I know a lot of podcasts do that to help build a community that no one would come to talk to me in there.
So that's my, I guess that's my big obstacle. Yeah, that would be my main one of creating a community specifically around this podcast.
Ida Radovanovic: Okay. And then the plan would be that. Okay, and you need to think about it this way. You should think, okay, I really want to have this amazing community and to support people, but I have also this fear that nobody will show up.
[00:13:00] And then, now you do an if. So, if I think that nobody will show up, then, and now you come up with some kind of an action. What could it be?
Rachael Botfield: Why no one would show up or?
Ida Radovanovic: Yeah, like what comes to my mind, it could be that I will remind myself of all the other times when people did show up.
Rachael Botfield: Oh, right. Yes. You know?
Yeah. Yes, that's true. Okay. I would remind myself, you know, that I've had, I've spoken to different people that have listened to the podcast and they have told me that they really enjoy it and they got something out of it and that if they had any other questions they'd ask me. So I guess just to remind myself of that.
I've had, you know, some people have said that. So it must be helping somebody, hopefully.
Ida Radovanovic: I'm sure you are. Oh, you know, for example, with the, because you also smiled at the busy thing, because we are all busy. So if you feel like, oh, but I'm too busy to now be, you know, I don't know, reaching out to people, creating, like making these content strategies, then I [00:14:00] can, you know, carve out a time in my calendar and actually block that too.
Do X, Y, Z, you know, so it is a little bit of that kind of a process. So you can, you sit down, you go through what you would really love this to be, what is the ideal outcome? Then you let your inner inner critique go and then you make a plan. So what you will do. So that's, for example, that this really helps you.
This planning system helps you with kind of a mindset to go forward. Then we have another planning system which is called backwards goal planning. And this is really cool because instead of like, okay, I should do this and this and this, you go, or you're like, I need to publish an episode. Okay. But before publishing an episode, what do I need to do?
You're like, I need a speaker. Okay. But before I need a speaker, what do I need? Oh, I probably need to research speakers or find some people. Okay. But before that, and you know, you go step by step by step, which then leads you to your first step. So now you have a plan on how you will. [00:15:00]
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, I like that, they're working backwards from it, sometimes that's easy because you'll start, sometimes it's the staring at the blank page, isn't it?
You're going, I've got to come up with the first thing, whereas if you, if you start with the outcome that you want, then working backwards can help, can help with that. Yeah, that's great, I like that one.
Ida Radovanovic: Cool. I hope, you know, maybe not each one will be relevant for everyone, but maybe people can find different angles that will support them.
Yeah. Then a third tip that I had, you know, is if you are like, okay, I'll post, or I will publish, or I will like when, and then you're kind of not doing it. This one is just a little bit more like. to try to work with less perfectionism and more kindness towards yourself. And then, you know, kindness can be like that you take a break, or like, kindness can be that you go walk in the park, or like, maybe let it sleep over.
Because when we [00:16:00] get short, like, okay, like I'm moving, I know I'm creating on my website, I move the colours a little bit, this a little bit, it takes ages. But sometimes you need to kind of step back. Or the other one, which I really like is to make it a little bit like a game. You know, how can you make it more exciting?
And this one is not a podcast-related example, but for example, I really procrastinate with washing dishes. So I found a small system for myself or a game that I and it goes different ways. But I choose a favourite song and then I race against my song to see how many dishes I can wash in this one song.
Oh,
Rachael Botfield: that's really funny. That's really good. Actually. That's a good way to make it more fun.
Ida Radovanovic: And you know, when you zoom out, actually, you know, then like a, let's say a little bit of a philosophical thing here is then you see that this thing that you're postponing, that's draining you, which what we do with our tasks actually took.
three minutes of a song. So [00:17:00] sometimes it's good to be reminded, you know, all this energy that goes into worrying or spiralling or overthinking versus like do it and okay, that's perfect or something fun. Yeah.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, I do. I find that. Well, so sometimes when my husband, this is not podcast related, but sometimes when my husband's away a lot and I've got the kids and cooking team, I'm really tired and I was like, Oh, I just can't be bothered.
But then I think, no, I'm going to put up. I, this is when I kind of listened to podcasts as well. I think Whatever podcast I want to catch up on and then I kind of get absorbed in that. So even though I didn't want to do it, I think actually I've managed to listen to a podcast episode that I really wanted to listen to and I've learned something or I've had a laugh or something like that.
And then also I've cooked tea and not just gone, Oh, I'm just going to eat something rubbish or, you know, buy something easy. So that was, I kind of do that similar thing there to cry and egg myself on to do something. But I do also. Agree with you about taking a break sometimes or when you do get in your own head.
When I first, when I first niched into [00:18:00] podcasting, I had my virtually inspiring podcast, which was I just wanted to start a podcast and I was interviewing other virtual assistants. And I've got really in my head about like releasing the episodes and am I doing it right? I've not done it right before, but I want to be a podcast manager.
Shouldn't I know all these kinds of things? That really got in my head about it. And I thought just in the end I was like, you know what, just, just get it out there and see what people think. And, you know, you get, you have to just get over that little thing. And, and often that does, you know like you've bonged it up, you've let it go and actually makes you feel a lot better.
So yeah. Taking, taking a break or just hit and go and then go, right? I'm gonna hit go and turn my computer off and then it's all gonna be fine. , and of course, it is always fine, but
Ida Radovanovic: You know what they say about post and ghost on Instagram, I do it as well.
Rachael Botfield: I was, I had a real thing about posting on Instagram when I first started my business.
I was kind of like, who wants to hear from me? And what if I say something wrong and I mean, not that I say very, you know, outrageous things or [00:19:00] anything like that for people to be trolling me or anything, but not that it takes much apparently. I know a lot of other people I see that are, you know, getting trolled and, or told LinkedIn isn't a, not Facebook and things, but that really held me back. But then I guess, cause I, I decided just to do it to just be brave, post them in there and then started to build a community of people. Cause obviously it started out with, with zero people, you know, going into the online space, but then you find, you start finding your tribe, finding those people that you connect with and.
then it becomes a much more friendlier place, but it's, unless you start kind of doing it, you, you know, you're not going to get over that first hurdle. So it's trying to find a way that's going to get you over that first hurdle of your procrastination. And then hopefully.
Ida Radovanovic: And what about all those people, you know, who are missing out because you are waiting there and, you know, fixing like a tiny little editing team or, you
Rachael Botfield: know?
Yeah, absolutely. That's with the website as well. I [00:20:00] think I did get, I've had mine done recently and my amazing friend, Hannah helped me with the design and she supported me with a copy, but my first one, I just did it myself, very rough and ready. And I just. Just hit go and I thought I'm just going to, otherwise I was never, like you say, never going to get that information out there.
It was a great place to point people to, but if you spend too much time, yeah, can hold you back. And, you know, it is messy doing stuff, running your own business and, you know, putting yourself out there doing podcasts or whatever, your passion project is, or, you know, business. It is, it does make you feel, especially it's the first time you're doing, it does make you feel a bit vulnerable.
And. you know, doing those things. So, and it only, I suppose, it only gets easier than you get to kind of the next level. And then you
Ida Radovanovic: have something new. Exactly, exactly. Yes. You know, with the perfectionism, I mean. I keep, I keep reminding myself I have a playground exactly for this reason and I say now I like [00:21:00] write it 80 percent is good enough and I kind of pride myself when I can and I feel so free to publish something that's 80 percent good enough.
So, you know, I think a different angle, like, yes, go out with something that you are, Oh, it's not according to your standards, a hundred percent. So what?
Rachael Botfield: Yeah. But you could always be searching for that a hundred percent though, can't you? It's like, well, there's always something that you could find wrong with it.
Something that doesn't look quite right. And then you just, like I say, that's when you just don't do anything about it then. So,
Ida Radovanovic: yeah. And sometimes it even drains you so much that now you no longer want to publish it or enjoy it. Like this great idea now became something that sucked the life out of you.
Yeah, we don't want that. No. We want you to be creating long-term.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, exactly. And I think that's potentially what a podcast could become if you know, you, you're already running your own business, you're busy with clients. You've got to market yourself as well. And, you know, you're thinking, can I add this extra thing?
in for my business, being [00:22:00] realistic about it. But also you don't want to make this awesome idea you had for a podcast with probably this great content. It's going to build your authority. You're going to connect more with your dream clients. It's also going to help you with your marketing. You can repurpose your podcast.
So it will be, it will help you, but you don't want to turn it into like a chain around your neck and then you don't, you know. Like you said, sucking all the joy out of your life or your business having it, you want to make it a positive, exciting thing to do a podcast and get that started.
Ida Radovanovic: Exactly. And I think it's a little bit like exercising as well.
You know, it's not like, okay, you started doing something, you're not going to have muscles immediately. Yeah. I mean, you will have to continue going and doing the training and that's part of the journey. So yeah, you get, you sustain your well-being because we are. Like whole beings. We are not just our product.
We are not just our podcast. We are not, we need to be there long-term. Yeah.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, absolutely. Looking at it like the bit, you know, the, the full [00:23:00] picture of everything that's, that's kind of going on. Those are great. I had, you have one more tip. Excellent. Go
Ida Radovanovic: on. We have one more. This was three. This was three and we have that extra one.
So my last one is that you know, there are just some of those days when you're like, oh, but I don't feel like doing it. So when you feel like that, or maybe you're a little bit lonely, you know? So I say on those days remind yourself how important it is to connect with others. So this could be that you're a part of a community, like what you're doing, go back to your community, to see what others are.
Posting, sharing resources, what's helping them, or get an accountability body. Those are I have found those to be really important and they serve kind of different purposes. So I'm part of several communities, but I also have my own accountability buddy. Because with one-on-one interaction with the person who is there to listen to you, but also you kind of, you know, that you will meet them in one week and they will [00:24:00] ask you, did you do your thing and you, and you don't want to like stand them up and you want to also be accountable to yourself.
So that really, really helps and makes a
Rachael Botfield: difference. Yeah, we were saying before we hit record. I love that accountability thing. My friend Hannah, who I mentioned before, she had, she loved, she rephrased it like accountabilibuddy, which I really love. Yeah. So we so she was, I was doing her set up for success course earlier this year.
And she was my accountability for getting my copy done for my website. You know, we decided on a timeframe. So that was really, and then getting that feedback as well, I think is really valuable. So you can, you can be that for each other with, with feedback if you want to get and it just makes it.
Sometimes it's really nice to get another set of eyes on what you're doing as well and, and getting that support. And yeah, so that's a really great, a really great recommendation.
Ida Radovanovic: Exactly because friends, of course they want to [00:25:00] support you and you can tell them your things, but somebody who is in a similar situation just knows what you're.
Going through, and some of us don't even necessarily have that person. So, but now when you have this, and you know what friends, they kind of cut you slack sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that you had a billy, but how did, how did you call it, Rachel?
Rachael Botfield: Accountabilibuddy.
Ida Radovanovic: Okay, it's a little bit hard to pronounce, but yes, that, then it's just different.
And you know that you're not alone in it because all the other tips that I told you before, you know, any kind of education or. To-do lists or my calendar or my Trello. I use all of them. I love all of them. But again, with those, I'm again alone. So it makes a difference to have somebody live there, like a live person that listens to you.
Maybe just listen, doesn't even need to give you feedback. But you can air out your thoughts, you can hear yourself and you can commit then to the next thing. [00:26:00] So,
Rachael Botfield: yeah, I, I do think, agree about if, you know, being in a similar situation to business wise as well, because you kind of, because you're in, you just have that relatability there for somebody, like say with your friends or your partner or anything like that, they're not in, if they don't have the same, you know, experience as you, it's, it's, it's a bit different.
So it's nice having that. You know, something that's the same between you and you know, you're both trying to achieve something and
Ida Radovanovic: yeah, yes, no. One friend told me when I was starting this business, he said, yeah, you know, when you break a leg, of course you will go to the doctor, but the doctor can't really understand it.
Somebody else who broke the leg that really knows what you're going through. Yeah, that's true. Yeah.
Rachael Botfield: Yeah, that is true. Yeah. Unless they broke the leg themselves, you have that. That's yeah, well, those are awesome tips. Yeah,
Ida Radovanovic: they will both help you, but it will be just different
Rachael Botfield: help. Yeah, differently.
Yeah. It's that perspective, isn't it? Getting that perspective on, [00:27:00] on what you're doing. Yeah. Well, those tips are really, really great. And as Ida mentioned earlier, we're going to put. So a little secret tip in there as well in the show notes, you can click on the link and download that resource for you to help you do an actionable thing for your business.
So you can move forward in your procrastination. Also, Ida has run some courses or cohorts, don't you, to help people with their projects and procrastination. So do you want to tell us a little bit about how you, how that all works and how it helps?
Ida Radovanovic: Mm hmm, sure. So, I have the anti-procrastination program.
It lasts for 13 weeks or 3 months, and it is for people who come with a particular project that they want to work on, so something that you're maybe offering. Putting off, or, you know, it could be something that you really love and you want to start, or maybe some part of your business that you're like, oh, I really don't want to do admin, but it's also part of my business and I need [00:28:00] to so then I connect people to become accountability buddies and they meet once a week, but it's not just like that.
People get connected. Each meeting is very structured, so it's actually a system. So you can, you need to specify right. down what you will do until next week. And that's, so that's always an outcome. So you know what you're doing next. And then when you come back, then you are asked, okay, did you do it?
Did you not do it? What did you learn? So this is really important that we also reflect on what we did, what went well, and what didn't go well. Yeah. But apart from that, you know there is also this creative element of games. So that you can talk about your creation. So in the first one, for example, you talk about why is this even important for you.
And this is a major procrastination tip because when you don't feel like doing it, if you know that why, well, you know, like Rachel, you're like, but now I'm creating this community. And like, if, if I'm not doing this and all of these people, okay, I don't know if they will be [00:29:00] lost, but it's certainly very helpful.
Then this really helps you. to continue creating. Then in the second one, we have a game around planning. Then in the third one, we have a game around what are you good at? So how can you capitalize on your strengths? So those are the kind of things that we do in the program. And we will start in the last week of October.
Rachael Botfield: So it's coming up soon, and it sounds like a great way to move forward with that big project you've been putting off. Ida has a little gift for you if you decide to join her
Ida Radovanovic: program. Yes, the little extra thing that I want to add to support you to stop procrastinating is that I'm also including a little discount so that you can decide today or tomorrow that if you want to start working on your project you even have that little extra
Rachael Botfield: benefit.
Oh, that's really kind Ida. So that's for all the listeners. If you're interested in taking part in [00:30:00] Ida's program, then there will be a discount, there'll be a link and all the information you'll be able to find in the show notes and all of where you can connect with Ida as well. And yeah, thank you so much for coming on.
Do you want to just tell us quickly, where do you hang out the most, where people can find you the most?
Ida Radovanovic: Well, I am mostly on Instagram, but if you prefer LinkedIn, you can also contact me there. So on Instagram, I share a lot of tips tips like these, tips that you can try, simple tips. So that simple and free tips.
So maybe you want to do that first before joining the program. Yeah. It's totally up to you. As long as you start. Working on that thing that you're not doing.
Rachael Botfield: Yes, that is absolutely true. And that's brilliant. So yeah, we'll pop all your Instagram and links in the show notes, like I just said. And yeah, thanks so much for coming on and we'll see everybody soon.
Bye.
Ida Radovanovic: Bye.